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Shimano reverse compatible (11/10) derailleur???
 

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/4/16 12:46 PM

Shimano reverse compatible (11/10) derailleur???

I am having no luck Googling info on this.

Anyone?

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Nick Payne
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: Canberra, Australia

12/4/16 1:23 PM

According to Carlton Bale, no: http://carltonbale.com/shimano-di2-everything-you-need-to-know/#compatibility

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/4/16 1:32 PM

I am already up to that point in knowledge, thanks. Pretty sure anyway, but see that page was updated:Sunday, December 4, 2016 11:33:21 AM So I will look at it again.

I do know it well from my researching my Di2 pieces and subsequent install on my Addict recently.

Greglepore made a comment in the 2017 Roubaix thread I am trying to follow up on.

Hoping someone else or Greg might embellish on any knowledge of this.


quote:
Di2 is worth the money, and Shimano recently impressed me by releasing reverse compatible (11 speed to 10) derailleurs to solve the problem of the 10 spd stuff being out of production

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sanrensho
Joined: 20 Feb 2004
Posts: 835
Location: North Vancouver

12/4/16 1:53 PM

I first read about it on WeightWeenies.

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=142606

Technical Bulletin:

http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/um/SI-5X20A-004-00-ENG.pdf

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/4/16 2:03 PM

Thanks, I did not see anything new on the cartonbale page. But thanks for posting it, anyone seeking info for this stuff should be aware of the cartonbale page to be sure.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/4/16 2:35 PM

OK, the 7970-A is strictly a Di2 reverse compatible thing, or did I miss something? Presumably for 10s Di2 repairs.

I guess Shimano giving 10s Di2 owners only one path from 10s Di2 parts you can't get anymore is bad. Bad in that if we have to replace the entire system we may well shop the non 'Shimano' brands offering electronic groups.

Love me or loose me forever? ;)

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5096
Location: Nashua, NH

12/4/16 3:43 PM

Typical Shimano

It's all about selling new stuff with them; they don't care about making anything serviceable. I don't know why anyone puts up with this when there are comparably priced and equally functional products from SRAM on the mechanical side and arguably better products in the electronic arena.

Campy typically costs more, but again, they offer full serviceability and IMO, their products are functionally superior to either of the "S" brands.

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sanrensho
Joined: 20 Feb 2004
Posts: 835
Location: North Vancouver

12/4/16 4:30 PM

"OK, the 7970-A is strictly a Di2 reverse compatible thing, or did I miss something? Presumably for 10s Di2 repairs."

Yes, the RD-7970-A provides a backwards compatible interface for 10s Di2 owners whose rear derailleurs have failed (unrepairable).

Having said that, it isn't that hard to find used working RD-7970 rear derailleurs, although prices are high.

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greglepore
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 1724
Location: SE Pa, USA

12/4/16 5:14 PM

Yes, that's what I was referring to. Used 7970 rear derailleurs are available, but pricey (paid over 350 for two recently, one for me and one for a buddy). At least Shimano did the engineering to make the current rd work with 10 speed, and the odd connectors for 7970 (there's an Ultegra version out there as well).

How is that a bad thing?

And Campy? Well g springs are still around, but a lot of their small parts are NLA. And the current shifters? When they fail, the remedy is to purchase a new shifter body-just had to do this for a guy in my club with a failed right Chorus brifter.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/4/16 6:24 PM

I want to see Brian's face when Shozaburo is standing aside St Peter when Brian gets upstairs to the top floor.

I will not see it, being I'll be in the basement. ;)

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5096
Location: Nashua, NH

12/4/16 7:53 PM

Sparky, I have no idea what you're referring to

I'm an atheist anyway.

Regarding Campy parts, Greg is correct when it comes to older shifters. With Shimano, you can't even buy parts for their current or recent products . That's BIG difference and in my opinion, it's just plain sleazy and disrespectful of the people who keep them in business.


Last edited by Brian Nystrom on 12/4/16 8:01 PM; edited 1 time in total

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Anthony Smith
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 848
Location: Ohio

12/5/16 12:32 PM

Microshift

IMHO, Microshift mechanical is the only way to go. Our team has been racing on it since 2010 (then branded as "Token". Replaceable parts, deadly accurate shifting, very reasonable prices and tough as nails.

Just an illustration, we have had several crashes over time which impact the blade on the brake lever. With the Microshift lever, one can easily replace the lever brade in minutes with a 4mm allen wrench and a small philips screwdriver. One allen bolt, three small screws, old lever blade off, new one on, no need to remove the lever from the bars or to disconnect either the brake cable or the shift cable. Can't do that with Campy, Shimano, or Sram.

Likewise the derailleurs are servicable down to the pins and springs, and for around 250.00 you can get brifters and front and rear derailleur with cables and housing in either 10 or 11 speed. Works with Shimano/Sram cassette spacing.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/5/16 1:22 PM

Shozaburo=Shimano, St Peter=Pearly Gates

Atheist or not, reference usually does not go unnoticed I figure. ;)

You got the St Pete part anyway.

I poked fun because I see this Campy fan-boying just as I see the redundant fan-boying on music forums about a few things.

I guess I am of the position that a bike/git/amp is a hammer. The purpose is for hammering, an analogy which works for riding a bike a bit better than music perhaps.

But the 'doth protest' too much usually applies, no offense intended.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC

12/5/16 1:48 PM

Bike as tools

I used to be a Campy fan, partly just pragmatism (it fits my smaller hand better) and partly on philosophical ground (can be repaired, in theory).

But when I got my cross bike, I needed the kind of gearing only Shimano can offer (road chainring with mtn cassette). So I swallowed my pride and had it equipped with Shimano drive train.

After nearly 10 years of equally flawless services, with one or two crashes in between requiring minor repair, I've changed my view. The Shimano stuff works so solidly, the "throw away design" aspect really doesn't come into play enough to justify the hate!

Granted, if one crashes a relatively new Shimano shifter that can't be repaired, one is justified to scream bloody murder by Shimano. But for most of us who thankfully don't crash every few months, the lack of "repairability" of Shimano parts is simply too theoretical to be... irrelevant.

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5096
Location: Nashua, NH

12/7/16 7:30 AM

SRAM offer equal or more versatility than Shimano...

...at a lower price, with complete serviceability. Serviceability is not just an issued after crashes, it's an issue when parts simply wear out from use.

Shimano is basically the Microsoft/Comcast of the bike industry; they get away with piss-poor customer service simply because they're the biggest player in the game.

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