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FROOME - Spolier Content
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Nick Payne
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: Canberra, Australia

7/19/13 2:03 AM


quote:
did rampant EPO, testostorone, etc. result in riders tipping over dead? No.
Yes. Between 1987 and 1990 about 20 Dutch and Belgian cyclists died suddenly, and the cause is thought to be EPO use (EPO became available in 1987). And they were still dying well into the noughties, albeit at a lesser rate as the side effects became better known.

In any case, it's not so much the professional cyclists at World Tour level with medical support who are likely to kill or injure themselves by rampant doping, but the competitors further down the food chain who don't have such support, and a lot of whom probably operate on the basis that if a little has beneficial effects, then more must be better still.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC

7/19/13 12:09 PM

More the reason to make it "legal"?


quote:
In any case, it's not so much the professional cyclists at World Tour level with medical support who are likely to kill or injure themselves by rampant doping, but the competitors further down the food chain who don't have such support, and a lot of whom probably operate on the basis that if a little has beneficial effects, then more must be better still.

Wouldn't it be more beneficial to publish the optimal dosage to use instead? ;-)

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Nick Payne
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: Canberra, Australia

7/19/13 11:40 PM


quote:
Wouldn't it be more beneficial to publish the optimal dosage to use instead? ;-)
I don't think that would help. The world is full of people who think they know best, and from the sporting results point of view, the more EPO you take the greater the oxygen-carrying capacity of the blood and the better the results - up to the point where you drop dead because your blood has become too thick to be pumped around the body...

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Dave B
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 4511
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

7/20/13 5:56 AM

Doesn't Exist


quote:
Wouldn't it be more beneficial to publish the optimal dosage to use instead?

There is no such thing as a universal "optimum dose" as the dosage has to be customized for each person. Those with inherent low hematocrit values can tolerate more EPO than those with normally high values. That's why all of the major teams had on-staff doctors to monitor its use and why unmonitored riders can kill themselves with it.

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5096
Location: Nashua, NH

7/20/13 7:51 AM

Legalizing cheating is NOT the answer

All that would do is encourage people to push the limits of how much drug abuse the human body can stand. That's happened in the past with grizzly results. More riders will surely die if the sport goes down that path.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

7/20/13 10:03 AM

And then there are cases of infusing ones own blood that has expired for any number of reasons, thus causing rider to in fact be expired. I have read this sporadically, but have no examples...

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KerryIrons
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 3234
Location: Midland, MI

7/20/13 6:53 PM

Ricardo Ricco


quote:
And then there are cases of infusing ones own blood that has expired for any number of reasons, thus causing rider to in fact be expired. I have read this sporadically, but have no examples...


On 6 February 2011 Riccò was admitted to a hospital in critical condition with sepsis and kidney failure, allegedly due to a blood transfusion he performed on himself with 25 day old blood.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

7/20/13 8:10 PM

So it looked like on today's stage Froome was trying to repeat Merckx's 1970 record of finishing in Paris with the Yellow and Polka Dot Jerseys... Until he got schooled on climbing that is....

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Nick Payne
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: Canberra, Australia

7/20/13 10:30 PM

In 1968 Merckx won all three jerseys in the Giro, and in 1969 he did the same in the TDF. And if the white jersey category for best young rider had existed in either event at the time, he would have won those as well, being only 22 at the time of the 1968 Giro and 24 at the time of the 1969 Tour. He also won all three jerseys in the 1974 Tour de Suisse.

The only other riders I know of who have won all three jerseys in a major tour are Phil Anderson at the 1985 Tour de Suisse, Tony Romiger at the 1993 Vuelta, and Laurent Jalabert at the 1995 Vuelta. There are quite a number of riders, including Merckx himself on five other occasions, who have won two jerseys at a grand tour.

BTW, did you know that Merckx is now Baron Merckx - he was granted the title by King Albert in 1996. He also has a railway station in Brussels named after him.

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sandiway
Joined: 15 Dec 2003
Posts: 4902
Location: back in Tucson

7/21/13 4:27 AM

Ax 3 Domaines stage

I read an analysis that said that Froome did the signature climb in the same ballpark time as Lance :)

Sandiway

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 3307
Location: Springfield

7/21/13 8:24 AM


quote:
Wouldn't it be more beneficial to publish the optimal dosage to use instead? ;-)
I got the joke / irony.

I'm thinking infomercials for at home kits, centrifuge, needles and all.

You've got couple of levels going there, April.

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bikerjohnpostal
Joined: 21 Sep 2004
Posts: 700
Location: Grass Lake, Mi

7/22/13 7:46 AM

Maybe

It could be available through Carmichael Training Systems?

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Paul Datars
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 1229
Location: Manotick, Ontario, Canada

7/22/13 9:04 AM

Found it...

"The truth is at the bottom of a bottomless pit." per Jerome Facher, from pg 340 of "A Civil Action".

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Wheels
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 1160
Location: Needham, MA

7/22/13 9:09 AM

Infomercial Material?


quote:
It could be available through Carmichael Training Systems?


I bet he tried to distance himself real quick once LA was under the intense magnifying glass.

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dan emery
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 6884
Location: Maine

7/22/13 9:19 AM

excellent research Paul

I actually never read the book, but I saw the movie (which I thought was great), and I followed the case off and on for years in legal periodicals. I felt kind of vicariously connected to it - Schlictmann graduated from my law school the year before I got there so his name was familiar, I have several friends at Facher's firm, I sat in a meeting or two with Cheeseman, etc. I really should read the book.

Sandra Lynch, who is now Chief Justice of the First Circuit Court of Appeals, I think has a brief mention in the book as she was at one of the firms at the time. I heard her speak awhile back and she siad that she was disappointed as she thought Jane Fonda should play her in the movie.

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Paul Datars
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 1229
Location: Manotick, Ontario, Canada

7/23/13 8:07 AM

That's cool Dan.

I never saw the movie and after reading the book probably wouldn't want to, be pretty hard for a movie to live up to the book I imagine.

Anyway, obviously I have a copy and I finished with it yesterday, so if you want me to mail it to you just say the word I'd be happy to do so. It's 502 pages of small print so I'm surprised I finished it in less than a week, although it helped that the TdF was finished Sunday.

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