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So Trumps white house is QVC now?
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 9:39 AM

"To be honest, I inherited a mess"

He shoulda been in OB's shoes as far inheriting messes. Then he actually could have something to cry like a little bitch about.

1:17 minutes he should actually be doing the work of the people. Not working so hard to get in front of the mic to brag that his administration is running "like a fine tuned machine". Which any other Moron can see that just because he sez so does not make it so.

A DJ AVG of 2k and 5% employment... Yeah, you got handed a mess.

This is all I hear when he flaps his moronic garb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyLsO6LpLSI

And this? Are you fucking kidding me?

‘They friends of yours?’: Trump asks black reporter to set up meeting with Black Caucus


At least the GW variety of moron had navigable puppet strings.

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Tom Price
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 395
Location: Rochester, NY

2/17/17 10:31 AM

Alternative Facts

Trump with 306 Electoral votes "best since Regan".

2012 Obama: 332
2008 Obama: 365
2004 Bush II: 286
2000 Bush II: 271
1996 Clinton: 379
1992 Clinton: 370
1988 Bush I: 426
1984 Regan: 525
1980 Regan: 489

Does President Pussy Grabber know how to use Google? He can not even get simple facts correct. What the F#&k!!

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 10:53 AM

"know how to use Google?"

His devices only do Twitter as you are probably aware. ;)

Besides which, he knows after his run the internets are full of BS more now that ever. From 'HIS' fake news et al. ;O

"He can not even get simple facts correct."

He clearly dismisses anything he does not want his subjects to think. See my "what fascism looks like" thread. He's been KING of his own privately owned enterprises for so long he knows no other way then to rule his empire, let's face it.

He seems to be demonstrating that he really may well be unfit for the job.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/17/17 12:40 PM


quote:
He seems to be demonstrating that he really may well be unfit for the job.

I haven't been posting lately. Because I'm disgusted, not of our newly elected president being "unfit for the job", but of a large percentage of population being "unfit for the job" voters!

Trump had not changed all of a sudden. He's very much true to himself throughout the campaign. There's no surprise of his actions. We who didn't vote for him knew that's who he is. Those who voted FOR him also knew that's who he is. They may be wishfully thinking he's better than he appeared to be. That's where all those "alternate facts" comes in, just people's wishful thinking.

The last thing we need is him being impeached soon. Not because Pence will be the President. But because those who voted for him "for change" will believe it's the establishment who will do anything to stop any real change.

We HAD TO allow this guy to screw up some more before doing anything to stop him. Those who voted for him will be the ones who will get hurt the most. They need to suffer directly under Trump so they may have a chance to wake up.

But if that doesn't wake them up, this country is screwed.

(but that's my position all along. We got the president we deserved. We as a population as a whole are short-sighted and self-centered. So we got a president who caters to that quality of the population)

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 12:57 PM

"large percentage of population being "unfit for the job" voters! "

"We as a population as a whole are short-sighted and self-centered. So we got a president who caters to that quality of the population)"


I should have just quoted your entire post April, then typed "Hear Hear!"

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 2819
Location: Springfield

2/17/17 1:13 PM

but of a large percentage of population being "unfit for the job" voters!

To me the ones who didn't show up are the ones unfit. Okay, not the only ones unfit!

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/17/17 6:03 PM


quote:
To me the ones who didn't show up are the ones unfit

I feel differently there.

Some people really don't care. And some people can't decide, either because they realize they don't have the time or the capacity to make an informed decision. Would they be better off not voting instead of voting based on incomplete information?

This election I think is a good indication of that. I know of several people who in the past didn't feel strongly one way or another and choose not to vote. They felt strongly enough to vote this time!

And didn't Trump motivated many previously non-participant to vote for him? The failure of the Democrats were they didn't motivate more of the anti-Trump people to feel strongly enough to actually vote.

So yes, for those who didn't want Trump to be the president but didn't vote for Hillary, they have 4 years to reflect on their decision. (and in that camp I include those who "wasted" their vote on the third party candidates, especially in the swing states )

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 6:15 PM

"those who didn't want Trump to be the president but didn't vote for Hillary"

How so? No matter how we voted at our house, OR was going DEM where it mattered, Electoral College.

When we lived in TN the opposite color, but our vote same difference [as DEM], How we voted or if we did or didn't would have made no difference, it was going GOP, end of story. No?

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/17/17 6:35 PM

That's why I say "especially in the swing states".

In New York, I respect people who voted Trump, or third party. They're basically making a statement. I may not agree with their position, but they're exercising their duty as citizen.

It's not the same in a swing state. There, every vote matters. It's not the place for statements. It's the place for result that matters.

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dddd
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 3151
Location: NorCal

2/17/17 6:38 PM

It wasn't the first election where the candidates that voters had to chose from looked like a deliberate effort to leave them with no one that they could vote for.
Hillary is who she is, but the media reported on her repeatedly taking huge sums from the same bankers who shattered/looted the country pre- and post-2008.
I wouldn't discount the possibility that the ostensibly Hillary-leaning media were in fact deliberately (apparently with Hillary's actual cooperation) directing voters to the republican candidate, since his peculiarities can be used later on to fill in a fabricated historical narrative to explain the loss of the US's position in the world, and the necessary further fleecing of that country's population. It's Directed History at it's best, as was the case surrounding the years of WWII. Donald appears to be playing the role that has been charted for him, and the timely deliberate vacating of Syria seems ominous. The quantitative status of the Federal Reserve Note is the weather vane that will indicate imminence of whatever big changes that have been scheduled, though may be little better than hindsight by the time that any big changes are reported.
Blaming the voters for the DT victory reminds me too much of the anti-US rantings of Noam Chomsky, who always seems to imply that "we" did this, and "we" are responsible for that. He's a fraud, covering for the unending, unexplained consequences of the hidden agenda actions of the world's financial elite, the power behind the crowns. Also bit like Robert McNamara reflecting on the consequences of a supposed "fog of war" that "we" ostensibly and in hindsight should have prevented. Like "we" had any good choices?

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 6:50 PM

"It's not the same in a swing state. There, every vote matters. It's not the place for statements. It's the place for result that matters."

Okies

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/17/17 6:53 PM

So the conspiracy theory...

...that went rogue?

Almost all history's conspiracy theory turned out to be LESS than meet the eyes.

No one disputes the voters had no good choices. I don't mean between Hillary and Donald the persons. But the fight between continuing "business as usual" vs "change for change's sake".

To me, it's like a 5 year old who, when told he can't play with the toy alone, decides he'll eat it instead! The next 4 years of stomachache will be intense.

We are a collection of people, some of whom never grown beyond age of 5. I personally believe "we" are responsible for the result collectively. I did my part, someone else did his to cancel out mine. That is democracy.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/17/17 7:31 PM

I don't see how he isn't going to shoot himself in the foot. How long it will take is a great question. We will have to wait and see what the answer will be.

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Matthew Currie
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 717
Location: Vermont

2/17/17 8:40 PM

I keep hearing about voters who voted for Trump because they wanted a change. Clinton too business as usual. Now they're having remorse because he turns out to be exactly what they voted for.

It's like going to the grocery store, and there's plain old chicken, and you say, yuk, I've been eating chicken all week. I want steak. Oh, here's a nice looking steak. It has a sticker on it that says it may contain up to 50 percent maggots and rat feces, but it' looks very tasty...

Hillary is not very cuddly, but if you voted for Trump you got exactly what you voted for. As far as I'm concerned, even if you weren't in a swing state and your vote technically did not count, if you wanted to make a statement you could vote Libertarian or write in Donald Duck. If you voted for Trump you got exactly what you voted for.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 2819
Location: Springfield

2/17/17 8:50 PM

He's a salesman, she's a sellout.

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 3747
Location: Nashua, NH

2/18/17 8:27 AM

I'm still of the opinion...

...that a vote for Trump was actually a vote for Pence, since Trump will likely either be taken out by some whackjob (hopefully not) or be impeached in relatively short order. I'd prefer it if the Republicans in Congress revolted en masse and forced him to resign, but his ego would never allow that. It's also starting to look like there's a possibility of him being declared mentally incompetent to remain in office, which would really be a treat. Regardless, at the rate things are going, I'd be surprised if he makes it to the end of the year.

Once Gorsuch is confirmed to the Supreme Court, I really don't care what happens to Trump. I can't stand him and the sooner he is out of office, the better, but there was no way I was going to give Hillary the chance to pack the Supreme Court with big-goverment-loving, Second-Ammendment-hating liberals. There was no good choice for me in this election, just one that I feel is better in the long-term and I'm willing to endure some short-term pain for that. I'm sure that a lot of Trump voters fall into this camp.

Regarding Pence, while he's way too "Religious Right" for my taste, at least he's a respectable human being who in-turn respects the traditions and decorum of the government. He also understands what it takes to make it work. Unless he somehow gets entangled in a Trump-related scandal, I'm confident he'll be able to pick up the pieces after Trump is gone. Worst-case, if Pence goes too, IIRC the Speaker of the House is next in line. A President Ryan could be very interesting!

And what if I'm wrong? For Trump to survive, he's going to have to change dramatically, which could only be a good thing. While the likelihood of that seems infinitesimally small, I guess it's not zero. ;-)

As for remorse, I don't think that there's much of it at all, as there was little doubt what would happen. Perhaps some people hoped that President Trump would be different than candidate Trump, but that's clearly not going to be the case. The courts will keep him in check and prevent the worst of his potential abuses, as we've already seen. It's going to be ugly, but it won't be disastrous and it probably won't last for long.

I do feel a deep sadness that our political systems is so dysfunctional that Trump and Hillary could actually end up as the nominees. Hopefully this was the wake-up call that we need to get more people involved in the political process and turn it around for the better, and prevent this kind of nightmare from happening again.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/18/17 9:08 AM


quote:
I do feel a deep sadness that our political systems is so dysfunctional that Trump and Hillary could actually end up as the nominees. Hopefully this was the wake-up call that we need to get more people involved in the political process and turn it around for the better...

There were MANY other Republican candidates to chooses from besides Trump. How many "more" do you need?

Hence my strong believe that's the voter's choice. Mostly Republican voter's choice.

As for voting for Pence after letting Trump became the nominee, that's quite a hail mary motive!

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 3747
Location: Nashua, NH

2/18/17 8:10 PM

Let me clarify for you, April

My hope is that more voters will get involved, not more candidates. Whether this current mess inspires more people to participate or drives them away remains to be seen.

I didn't vote for Trump in the primary and Pence wasn't picked as his running mate until weeks after the NH primary. I would not have voted for Pence to be the Republican nominee, if he had run. However, he would certainly be a better President than Trump and I expect that he's going to end up in the Oval Office pretty soon. It's only a matter of time until Trump is gone, one way or another.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 15729
Location: Portland, OR

2/18/17 8:59 PM

"better President than Trump and I expect that he's going to end up in the Oval Office pretty soon"

My money is on Pence getting taken down with DT if this 'Russian' shiet manifests the way it could. So Pres. Ryan happening would not surprise me as the eventual outcome.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/18/17 9:39 PM

Pence maybe a more traditional politician. But that's precisely NOT what Trump's supporters want.

So, if Trump was indeed to leave office "soon", I fear his supporters will see it as a conspiracy of the "political establishment" subverting the votes' wish.

The voters wanted change. They elected the man who will bring them change. They need to experience first hand the "change" they chose. They deserve that.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 2819
Location: Springfield

2/19/17 8:01 AM

revolted en masse and forced him to resign, but his ego would never allow that
The trump for president committee filed for reelection on inauguration day. This is a PDF of the document, posted by FEC. The time stamp is 5:11PM.

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 3747
Location: Nashua, NH

2/19/17 8:17 AM

Sparky, I hope you're right, as that would be the best possible outcome. However, Pence seems like he's smart enough to keep his nose clean and who knows, he may have been thinking about "inheriting" the presidency all along.

April, there's no doubt that when Trump falls, his ardent supporters will cry foul no matter what the reason is. Considering their lack of concern for the truth, conspiracy theories will run rampant. Maybe they'll blame it on Hillary... ;-)

Daddy-o, I'm not sure if that's unprecedented (I wouldn't doubt that), but it certainly does seem bizarre and just reinforces Trumps narcissism. Even if it's common, everything Trump does is going to be scrutinized to the Nth degree.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6068
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/19/17 8:50 AM

"he may have been thinking about "inheriting" the presidency all along"

I say he's DEFINITELY been thinking about that from the get go. In fact, it may be the ONLY reason he accepted the VP position!

This reminds me I'd better catch up with one of my riding buddy who's "expecting" to be working in Trump's team (because his boss was expecting an appointment) what his situation is.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 2819
Location: Springfield

2/19/17 9:08 AM

April, Brian, Sparky,

I thought I would add a quick edit to my PDF post but you guys are too good.

"Regarding Pence, "
Way too politically savvy is how I'd phrase it but with agreement of your assessment. Somehow I have (pardon the pun) faith that Pence will avoid the pitfalls of proximity to the p-. I understand overt religious faith != moral rigor but when it does it's tenacious, sword of Damocles and such. In a similar vein I think the p- got more than he bargained for in his SC nominee Gorsuch.

"Perhaps some people hoped that President Trump would be different than candidate Trump"
So far he appears to be little more than candidate t- with more gold paint.

"this was the wake-up call that we need to get more people involved in the political process and turn it around"
THE MASSES!!!
And maybe that will embolden candidates of the people who have avoided candidacy because of bullying and fallacious arguments.

"Hence my strong believe that's the voter's choice. Mostly Republican voter's choice. "
That's where primaries and redistricting comes in. Get out the vote in 2018, the 2020 census, redistricting under new control. Yeah I know, like a second marriage, hope triumphs over experience.

" that's quite a hail mary motive!"
Well played!

"Pence getting taken down with DT if this 'Russian' shiet manifests"
That's where 'moral rigor' comes in. Pence may well have alerted people about National Security Advisor Flynn's disinformative report to him.

"Pence maybe a more traditional politician. But that's precisely NOT what Trump's supporters want."
Truly a quandary for them, at least for the religious right segment of them. My opinion that segment go with faith over secular manifestations.

My fat for the fire:
I live in Maryland, one of the worst examples of gerrymandering and run by Democrats seemingly forever. Sure I'm cozy, but I see the weakness too.

Competition makes us strong (my old refrain.)(it makes us less cozy too.)

The "term limits" crowd is so dumb if they think term-limiting gerrymandered districts will bring positive change, you know my arguments.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 2819
Location: Springfield

2/19/17 9:34 AM

A nugget

Today I heard a word I'd forgotten about: sequester

Executive department budgets will not grow without 60 Senate votes to overcome filibuster.

That means 8 Democrats.

FYI: Sequestration will sunset in 2021

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