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Upgrade for 1999 Merlin Extralight with 2004 Campy Record Ti
 

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PMerckx
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 45
Location: Manila, Philippines

12/18/16 6:13 PM

Upgrade for 1999 Merlin Extralight with 2004 Campy Record Ti

I haven't been back on this forum for a while. Glad it is still very active!

After a few years' hiatus, I have been riding regularly again and getting stronger/fitter thanks to more structured power based training. Trouble is, riding with a younger squad is giving me a bad case of bike envy as I have a 17 year old frame with 12 year old components.

I have a 1999 Merlin Extralight (small) matched to 2004 Campy Record ti 10 speed components. All in, the bike weighs 7.1 Kg (15.6 lbs) with 2004 Zipp wheels or 7.4kg (16.4 lbs) with Shamal Ultras.

I'd like honest opinion if there is any real "upgrade" worth making to this bike assuming that I will keep the frame (which fits me well and is virtually a vintage collector's piece). Specifically:

Should I "modernize" my ride by going 11 speed? If so, is the new Campy stuff worth it or should I consider switching to SRAM etaps?

OR should I keep my Merlin as is and just replace parts as they wear out (which is a looong time with Merlin+Campy), and just buy a completely new second bike if I want to go modern (i.e. Cervelo C3 is tempting because of geometry, comfort stays, and discs).

Love to get anyone's thoughts.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/18/16 7:06 PM

Merlin would make a great winter bad weather steed. Then you can spend north of 10K US on a new bike. ;)

Welcome back!

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henoch
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 1690

12/18/16 10:54 PM

Welcome back.

To be honest, I don't really think that upgrading to 11 speed or anything is going to make much of a difference.
Most of the changes that have come to pass in the last 10 - 15 years have been in the frame design and construction (tapered had tubes, various shaped chain and seat says etc..) but if you are set on keeping that frame, I don't think upgrading components is going to change much.
Personally I'd suggest upgrading the bar and stem just from a safety perspective.

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sanrensho
Joined: 20 Feb 2004
Posts: 835
Location: North Vancouver

12/19/16 1:04 AM

Borrow or buy a used carbon bike with 11-speed. Sometimes just being on fresh gear or something different is nice and can jump start your riding.

If you find yourself riding the new bike more, move the Merlin to B bike status and get the latest and greatest for your A bike.

Honestly, it sounds like you want a new bike. Nothing wrong with that.

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Marc N.
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 457
Location: Israel

12/19/16 3:56 AM

New vs. old

PMerckx - I just went through the same choice. I got back on the bike a year ago after a 6 year break when I was running long distances. My frame was from 2001 with Campy Record 10 from 2007. The bike still rides and looks great, but I just wanted something new. There is something to be said for treating yourself to a new steed. The process is almost as much fun as the purchase.

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5096
Location: Nashua, NH

12/19/16 6:03 AM

Skip the upgrades

The extra cog isn't likely to make much difference, since Campy hasn't changed their available cassette range. While I did upgrade my Ti bikes from 9 to 10 speed in 2008, I haven't bothered to go to 11.

The bigger difference in performance is in the frames, particularly with carbon frames. You can knock a pound or so off the weight and get better power transfer. If your Merlin has a 1" steerer, you'll gain a lot of lateral stiffness in the front end, which helps with climbing and sprinting.

I switched from Ti to carbon frames on my two road bikes in 2011 and haven't looked back.

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PMerckx
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 45
Location: Manila, Philippines

12/19/16 8:10 AM

Thanks for the tips!

Thanks everyone for the advice! feels good to be back on this forum.

I think I will save up for a new steed, probably the C3 with discs and eTaps so there will be a substantial difference between the new bike and the Merlin.

Again thanks guys!

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Dave B
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 4511
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

12/19/16 8:14 AM

No

I don't see anything in what you already have that would be improved by an "upgrade". Unless you are a real weight weenie your bike is already very light and unless you need a significantly wider gear range you gain almost nothing by going to 11-speed.

Somehow I think your "younger squad" members are as envious of your bike as you are of theirs.

Keep the Merlin as it is and put what ever money you would have spent on it toward a second (or third or whatever) bike and get something really different. Carbon, eTap, DI2 or whatever.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/19/16 10:47 AM

A Note: I have not ridden other than the Addict since the Di2 went on. ;) Well one gravel jaunt on the Strong. ;)

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dddd
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 3345
Location: NorCal

12/19/16 12:11 PM

A disc-braked road bike will be a performance step backward, overall, unless you'll be riding in the wet or unless you want to step up to even wider rims than your Zipps.
A disc front brake requires a much-stiffer fork, which upsets the balance between frame flex and fork flex which have opposite effects on a bike's trail dimension when the front brake is applied and when the vertical load changes in response to abrupt changes in road pitch. Modern disc bikes are compensating for this with even stiffer frames (since the fork's tapered steerers tend to also be stiffer) and with much wider rims and tires (that can be run at much lower pressure).
Lastly, adding discs adds weight and reduces aerodynamic efficiency, so likely the pro racers will prefer them only when conditions are severe or when all the riders are suddenly required to use them by a change of rules.
The press has been really pushing road disc bikes without critical evaluaton of the numerous overall effects, but an exception to this has been Bicycle Quarterly, who test varied designs of bikes in quite-varied conditions.

A second bike can be good though, since you will henceforth be making an unconscious comparison between two bikes whenever you go riding.
This has done wonders toward my achieving a real-time best performance fit on the bikes I ride, and given me insight into what sort of geometry and setup that I prefer for my local riding conditions.

Consider adding a Merckx to your stable!(!) And (stepping way out of the box here), if you're not racing, consider a well-set-up friction-shifted bike that can play a role in developing better effort strategy in the hills by forcing the rider to think ahead. It actually gets to be entertaining, whether riding solo or (especially) when matching pace with riders using contemporary drivetrains.
A vintage bike might not be so easy to source where you live, but even if brought in could still be thousands less than a contemporary bike that depreciates greatly within the first year and goes further downhill from there.

I'll be heading out into the cold today on another "second" bike, so another fit evaluation is pending and another gearing strategy in the making. Starting out with the as-equipped, retro-friction, six-speed, C-Record setup, and will be soon be changing the stem, brake levers and bar tape for sure. It's still a heck of a lot less effort than riding a singlespeed after all.



Last edited by dddd on 12/23/16 6:19 PM; edited 2 times in total

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Craig
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 591

12/19/16 12:34 PM

The only thing you *might* notice is less chainring rub if you were to swap out to an external BB type crank. Over time and miles, and on a flexy titanium bike, a power based rider might notice some chainring rub when pedalling hard. A smaller frame is probably stiffer than larger titanium frames so it might not be an issue. But Brian made a very good point in that it's probably a 1" head tube on a 1999 bike, you're going to have a hard time finding a fork and every stem will need a shim to work. So......

Ride and maintain, use it in the rain and on the trainer, and buy yourself a new bike when you have enough money saved up.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19068
Location: PDX

12/19/16 12:45 PM

"A disc-braked road bike will be a performance step backward, overall, unless you'll be riding in the wet or unless you want to step up to even wider rims than your Zipps. "

Ingredients of your decision to be sure, and I agree with. After the disc Roubaix my path had it's priorities sorted differently than anticipated when I got the Roubaix.

It was the usual 'one does all' only doing a lot of the all just OK, and none of it fantastic.

I believe this is a two bike job after the experience.

Thus the Strong that replaced the Roubaix is purpose designed to go more to the dark [dirt] side than a bike that only can fit a 28-30mm tire max. But I am north of 200 lbs so a lighter rider may not need nor want to put bigger than that on a bike for adventure sport. Should that turn to be a use for said machine.

If you are a stickler for very light wheels, you should research those 'if/and/buts' for disc wheel VS non.

As far as wider rims, again; for me as a Clyde I feel it a worthwhile advantage.

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dddd
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 3345
Location: NorCal

12/19/16 4:14 PM

I agree with the sentiment about wider rims and tires, even on non-disc bikes and/or those with 1" steerers. That is one point that Bicycle Quarterly has been way ahead of the curve on, by doing actual tests demonstrating that bikes don't become slower with wider tires.

And as for the 1" steerers, I believe that lighter riders benefit from the more appropriate level of stiffness that they offer. I weigh about 140lb and often find myself choosing the most flexible of my bikes to head out into the real world on, since they give a more comfortable ride. Today's production bikes need to suit the heaviest riders who might ride them, stiffness-wise, and that just can't be a good thing for the lighter rider. Power transfer is important in sprint situations, but remember pro's (especially Sean Kelly) who rode flimsy Vitus aluminum frames to countless victories in the ranks of the world's top-level (i.e. very strong) riders.

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